The President speaks in Cairo, dealing with the relations between the United States and the Islamic World. While the President and the White House have downplayed expectations (no single speech…)the speech is an important part of the Obama foreign agenda. He is going to be criticized for this speech as well as other efforts, but the task is so enormous that a realization that the past failures should not be repeated has to be admired. In my view it is an effort worth making, and one based on realism. What do you think?
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Bill Manzi.com 
Your Honor,
The Arab Israeli conflict is 61 years old. It began after the United Nations resolution establishing a “2 state” solution. While the jews were happy to have a homeland the Arabs (Palestinians and the various arab states) had only one goal; to throw the jews into the sea. 5 arab armies attacked the jews but failed to defeat them, in fact lost some land. Then the palastinians began their terror raids. A series of wars and terror raids put everything where it is today.
Obama, now has thrown Israel under the bus by claiming the Palastinians have suffered at the hands of the Jews.
The Palestinians have suffered at their own hands. Questions, why are thers people living in refuge camps after all these years. There is certainly enough wealth in the Arab universe to set up towns in the West bank. It could have been done in 1948. The camps are there to breed fighters and terrorists.
Israel has built a thriving modern state under democratic principles.
So now we can add the Liberal Democratic party to the European states that treat Israel with disdain.
If Israel is destroyed, who will care?
Jules
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The Arab-Israeli conflict is a little older than that. If you want to see the genesis of the current conflict, that goes back to WWI and the mishandling of the situation by imperial Britain.
Start reading this thread from the World War I entry for a fuller viewpoint …
http://www.mideastweb.org/briefhistory.htm
The Palestinians have rights, too. Until Israel acknowledges this, and we work to be an honest broker in the region, there will never be peace.
That said, I like the speech that Obama gave: tough on both sides, conciliatory on both sides. Privately, the Israelis are getting the message from us to stop building more settlements and inflaming the issue, which is a good thing.
-FM
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Fred,
Palestinians had the same opportunity as the Jews after the UN vote in 1948.
Can you, in all your wisdom, tell me why the Palestinians did not take advantage of the same UN opportunity and create a viable state as Israel did?
Can you tell me why the Palestinians did not take advantage of Bill Clinton’s effort when Israel was ready to sacrifice land and compromise on Jerusalem. They turned down the offer and then began another assault on Israel?
After 50 or 60 years why are there thousands of Palestinians in camps? Don’t the Arabs care about their brethren. They keep them there as political hostages.
Keep in mind that the Arabs can lose many time, Israel only onence.
How let’s discuss your solution for this terrible situation. Keep in mind Hamas’ goal is the destruction of Israel.
Let’s for get Bill O’Reilly, Rush and Bush.
Jules
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http://polfeeds.com/item/Weekly-Address-President-Obama-Calls-for-Real-Health-Care-Reform ===>President Obama’s weekly Address. Topic is on Health Care Reform.
Gerard
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Peacekeeping efforts started before President Barack Hussein Obama was elected, but to no avail. Today, Obama carries the torch for a two-state agreement, (Palestine and Israel), but Israel is taking center stage as the land of the victimized. The truth of the matter is, they are both victims of each other. Each country has lost countless citizens, for what? Borders? It just doesn’t make sense.
President Obama, the Peacemaker, has once again started a dialogue between Muslims and Israelites. Where it goes from here is up to the two parties. One can only have the audacity of hope for so long. If they do not pick up the ball, it’s time to leave them to their own machinations.
So sick of the fighting in the Muslim World, in Israel, Afghanistan, Pakistan, North Korea and especially Iraq!
What kind of miserable world are we leaving to our children and grandchildren? It is a harvest of war, hatred, racism and hunger. All for the love of money and power.
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Jules:
I’ve never seen any evidence that Palestinians had the same opportunity to “get a state” in 1948. Can you provide a credible reference?
The inconvenient fact is that Israel was sited on land previously owned by Palestine: the double dealing British promised it to both. Palestinians were forcibly evicted from their homes, as Israel wanted a Jewish(-only) state. And we wonder why they fight. Who among us would not?
Palestinians had their last, best chance under Clinton, when he had Barak bent over a barrel. Too bad Arafat blinked. Certainly, the West Bank / Gaza Strip solution is not ideal: two parts of a single country separated by fences and Israeli guards?
My solution is to lock both leaderships in a room and not let them out again until a final peace is reached. Enough is enough.
I would love to forget Bill O’, Bush, and Rush, but with all the charm of a dose of the clap, they keep coming back.
LDone:
Boys with toys: if you give boys toys, all they want to do is take them out to play.
-FM
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Dear Fred Mertz — What does that statement mean, exactly, as pertaining to Muslims and Israelites? I really don’t get it. (Honestly)
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Fred,
1. For proof of the ‘opportunity to have their own state’ is wrapped in the 1948 UN vote to partition palestine into a Jewish and a palistinian state. Check it out.
2. Jews and Arabs have been at war since the early 20th century. The British who relieved Paleatine from the Turks during WWI took over as policemen.
3. There was no wholesale displacement of Arabs by Jews. There were some Jewish groups that took advantage of the confusion and settled old scores. The Stern Gang comes to mind. The vast majority left of their own free will as they knew Israel would be attacked by 5 Arab armies and assumed Israel would lose and then they would return to reclaim their homes and the homes of the presumed dead Israelies.
Of course the 5 Arab armies were defeated and the Arab refugees went in refugee camp. They are there today. Can you tell me why?
4. You say Arafat blinked. Actually he had no intensions of cooporating. A peaceful settlement would expose his corrupted government.
5. I think your idea of locking the leaders up in a room has a problem. Who would represent the Arabs? They are in the middle of a civil war and there is a divided leadership. PA tries to kill Hamas and Hamas tries to kill PA.
I thought you didn’t watch or listen to Rush et. al. because they made you sick. Oh yes, I forgot, your bloggers tell you what to think.
To bad. I would be exciting dicussing issues with you.
Jules
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LDone:
My comment is directed at your last one. It’s my long standing belief that in a world that is awash in arms, it’s inevitable that they will be used.
A simpler form may be “if all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail”.
-FM
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Jules:
Ahh, now you’re engaging … let’s see if we can keep things on plane …
1) And where in the 1948 declaration did the Palestinians have a say, and not the imperial powers that control the UN Security Council? That’s my point: the Palestinians are being treated as rag dolls, or dogs, take your pick.
2) Yes, and even before: that was also the point in my posting the entire history. The current conflict does have its genesis in WWI, when the imperial powers were still all about dividing the world as spoils of war.
3) Today, we would call the Stern gang and the lot “terrorists”. Palestinians are still in the camps because Israelis are occupying their land. Isn’t it that simple?
4) Did you happen to have a personal line to Arafat at the time? 😉
Actually, I think he would not have known what to do without the conflict that defined his life. Not like we haven’t had a few politicians like that in our recent past …
5) I still say lock ’em all up in a room.
The problem in all modern wars is that the people who make the decisions are not the ones whose lives are at risk. It’s far too easy to take decisions that only affect others. I’m even rethinking my strategy and considering putting arms in the back of the room. If any faction runs out of people, recruit new leadership and put them in the room. I think we could have saved about 3T and a lot of lives if we put Bush in a room with Saddam.
Israel’s opinion is summed up by Netanyahu’s Likud platform:
” … flatly rejects the establishment of a Palestinian Arab state west of the Jordan river … ”
” … it agreed that Palestinians can call whatever fragments of Palestine are left to them “a state” if they like — or they can call them “fried chicken” ”
Like I’ve said, I move to arguments that make sense to me. Your boys Bill O’ and Lush are to my mind bereft. It apparently works for you. Not for me, man.
Are you rooting for GM to fail yet?
-FM
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Thank you, Fred Mertz.
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Fred, my friends, I am thinking from your entries that you think that Israel should never had been allowed to have a country of its own. What is more important, you are saying the entire area constituting Israel should be disbanded. I get that especially from your comment, “Palestinians are still in the camps because Israelis are occupying their land.”
I don’t know how to reply to “down with Israel” philosophy.
Perhaps you might let me know if I drawn improper conclusions.
Your final judgment of the conservative commentators is still beyond me since, as you tell me, you don’t listen to them. You are apparently a creature of blog hate.
I don’t have to root for GM failure, Obama’s going to take care of that, just as he will do with the economy. It will be Jimmy Carter Redux.
Jules
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My Friend:
I’m sure you would take it that way, but I don’t paint the Israelis in the victim role in the current conflict as much as I paint the Palestinians. We say we’re about freedom and democracy in the region, we’ll spend 3T, 4000 American and hundreds of thousands of Iraqi lives to prove it (I guess, haven’t seen the conclusion to the movie), but then, we support the power that has become the oppressor just slightly to the west? Sticks and stones and mortars against tanks, APCs, and planes.
We need to be a little more even handed in the region. Palestinians need their freedom, their rights, their dreams, their children protected too. They need not be under the steel boot of the IDF.
On your commentator front, I’m reading and listening to people quoting, commenting, and most importantly, fact checking your commentators. I suspect it’s a little farther up the food chain than you’ve achieved, but you can correct me if I’m wrong. I don’t have the time or the room in my life to listen to people who lie, who misinform, who inflame, and demonstrably so. Their voices make no sense to me, and I believe are poisonous to the culture. It is but a short distance between words and deeds, as we found out (again) yesterday. It is my role as a citizen to not support these voices, and to speak truth to the lies, so that in the marketplace of ideas (or lack thereof), they wither and die the death that they should.
Even Shepard Smith of Fox almost made a dramatic slip yesterday … but if he made the connection between his network and these emails, he’d be looking for a new job. Who knows, maybe MSNBC would hire him for the Morning Joe show.
Don’t worry, this is one of your *approved* sources, Fox News. You can watch this one.
-FM
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C’mon, Shep: you’re oh so close to walking right up to that edge of sanity … c’mon … walk towards the light …
http://mediamatters.org/mmtv/200906100041
-FM
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Fred,
I was right, then, you want to disband Israel. To bad you lack the courage to say it.
I should not be surprised you would bring George Bush into this (comment about war for democracy).
Fred, your ranting. Can’t figure out what you are saying about commentators. You do hate the conservative guys.
At least we know one thing, you admitt being a Blog lemming.
Jules
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Jules:
Wow. 100% wrong. That’s gotta be a record, even for you!
Sorry you can’t figure out what I’m saying. Even if I try to keep it short to keep your attention span!
What color plugin hybrid GM are you going to order?
-FM
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Jules:
Now that you’re speaking of Bush the Younger again, you’ve reminded me: what did you think about that 10-12T in debt you asked about?
-FM
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