Lincoln Our Greatest President?

Abraham Lincoln, in a recent survey of 65 historians, was voted as our greatest president. James Buchanan was voted the worst. On this Presidents day what are your thoughts. If not Lincoln then who do you think stands above the rest? Some tidbits from the MSNBC story:

Compared to C-SPAN’s only other ranking of presidents, in 2000, former President Bill Clinton jumped six spots from No. 21 to 15. Other recent presidents moved positions as well: Ronald Reagan advanced from No. 11 to 10, George H.W. Bush rose from No. 20 to 18 and Jimmy Carter fell from No. 22 to 25.

George W. Bush?

Former President George W. Bush, who left office last month, was ranked 36th out of the 42 men who had been chief executive by the end of 2008, according to a survey conducted by the cable channel C-SPAN.

Bush scored lowest in international relations, where he was ranked 41st, and in economic management, where he was ranked 40th. His highest ranking, 24th, was in the category of pursuing equal justice for all. He was ranked 25th in crisis leadership and vision and agenda setting.

Interesting stuff for you history buffs out there. What say you?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22425001/vp/29137427#29137427.msnbcLinks {font-size:11px; font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; color: #999; margin-top: 5px; background: transparent; text-align: center; width: 425px;} .msnbcLinks a {text-decoration:none !important; border-bottom: 1px dotted #999 !important; font-weight:normal !important; height: 13px;} .msnbcLinks a:link, .msnbcLinks a:visited {color: #5799db !important;} .msnbcLinks a:hover, .msnbcLinks a:active {color:#CC0000 !important;}

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18 Responses to Lincoln Our Greatest President?

  1. Jules Gordon says:

    Your Honor,

    The greatest President was George Washington.

    After leading a ragtag force to victory over the strongest military machine in the world he went on to invent the Presidency. No one every led a Republican country under a constitution as we had before this time. He set the tone, the principles and practices for that office.

    He was the most beloved man of his age.

    As final proof we have the admiration from his most intractable enemy, King George who said when he heard that George Washington was to resign from the army rather than use it to capture power from a fractious continental congress, “If he does that he will be the greatest man in the world.”

    He did and was.

    Now Abraham Lincoln was the second greatest. He lead the country through it’s most difficult time since defeating the British during the revolution. He ended up knitting the country back together by his example as he never lived to see it accomplished.

    Interestingly, you moonbats will not share the sentiment as he did things which were not constitutional and would, according to the present Liberal party, be impeachable. More so than your nemesis George W Bush.

    I hope your bad case of BDS can be cured.

    Jules

    Like

  2. Fred Mertz says:

    Mr. Speaker:

    No, actually, I agree with most of your sentiments, only I would have reversed the two.

    Washington was probably the most honorable, Lincoln the most pragmatic. The blot on Lincoln was the suspension of habeas corpus, but given the depth of what he was able to achieve to preserve the union and had he lived, the peace afterwards, stunning. The very model of a hands-on presidency.

    The interesting lesson to draw for me is the lesson of pushing problems forward. The constitutional convention knew that slavery would be a problem going forward, but in order to achieve the compromise and build a union, the question of slavery was left for a future generation to solve, which we did, 80 years later with much bloodshed.

    A tale for our times, perhaps?

    -FM

    Like

  3. Jules Gordon says:

    Fred,

    Some answers to you points:

    I stick with Washington. He saw the war through more than eight years, ending with a professional army after beginning with a bedraggle militia. He himself proved to be a better escape artist as always seemed to be flanked in his early battles. However, once he emerged from Valley Forge he had a winning army and was a skilled general.

    He not only became the first President he also oversaw the development of the constitution as a calming respected voice within a contentious body.

    All this made him the best.

    Lincoln, on the other hand, was responsible for the death of 640,000 men, 60% union, 49% Confederate. His campaign for his second term was against McClellan a Democrat and a former General under Lincoln’s command. The Democrats wanted to capitulate and make a treaty with south,thereby dividing the union. It was the vote of the soldiers that put him over top. (lessons for today)

    Fred, I guess you can say, in light of todays conditions, Lincoln sucks and should be impeached as a murderer. Toward the end he was not popular until he was assassinated and the people found they indeed loved him.

    Obama followed the same route as Lincoln’s funeral train

    A great leader, an inspiring leader, a far sighted leader and a compassionate conservative (oops-sorry). He told Grant just before the surrender to,”let them up easy”.

    A close second place.

    As far as the constitution is concerned, it was “pass it as it was (IGNORING SLAVERY) or it was not to pass.

    It did take the Civil war to correct that, but it took the country that long to get to that point.

    Jules

    JULES

    Like

  4. Fred Mertz says:

    Jules:

    I’ll try and ignore the fact that I think you’re comparing Bush the Younger and Lincoln in the same paragraph. I think my head would explode.

    😉

    But, I think you’re right, he was unpopular when the larger, better equipped Union army was continually beaten by the smaller, more nimble, more ably led Confederate Army. Only after he sent McClellan packing and installed first Meade, then Grant and battlefield fortunes began to turn did he become more popular. Fortunes of war, I suppose.

    It’s funny how each generation tries to view itself in the myth/truth of Lincoln’s legacy.

    -FM

    Like

  5. Fred Mertz says:

    Jules:

    As long as we’re going to play …

    If you look at today’s situation, you should conclude that today’s Republican party is the heritage of the old Confederacy: limited federal power, states rights, etc. Today’s Democrats are more like the Union: promoting the idea that all men are created equal, with expanded government power.

    I’m sure you know where I’m going …

    -FM

    Like

  6. Jules Gordon says:

    Fred,

    Here’s the summary;

    1. The Republican party was the party of the north.

    2. The Republic party freed the slaves.

    3. Democratic Party was the party of states rights, served the rebellion, kept, worked and traded slaves.

    4. You are correct the Republicans (used to be) the party of small government and low taxes preferring to leave the economy up to private enterprise with appropriate regulation. Private enterprise is not perfect.

    5. Democratic party is a conglomeration of single issue activists who have only one thing in common,”what can the government do for me.” Final goal is socialism. It’s well on the way.

    Last week Chavez and the Democrats won thier respective socialist targets.

    Jules

    Like

  7. Fred Mertz says:

    Yes, but what are they now? Didn’t Republicans and Democrats switch identities sometime around 1964, at least as far as the South is concerned?

    Where is the Republican party now? The old South. Where are the Democrats? The old North. We’ve been refighting the Civil War (ahem, the War of Northern Aggression) now for 150 years (hey, I lived in the South for awhile too, and for some reason, they still take that kinda serious like).

    So, what can you conclude?

    Lincoln would have been a Democrat today.

    -FM

    Like

  8. Jules Gordon says:

    Fred,

    The Republican Party lost its way. I tried to become liberal. Don’t forget, Fred, it is easy to win when you are promising a chicken in every pot.

    The conservative party should call for self responsibility. Government only where it is required.

    However,Fred, the good news for you is we, as a society, have drifted to the left, leaving it up to the Obama’s to take care of us (we ask “ask not what I can do for my country, ask what can my country do for me”)

    Case in point was Obama’s trip to Fort Meyers with most questions asked were “what will you do for me; make my benefits better, increase my unemployment to what I was making while employed, get me a car, kitchen, etc.”

    I was embarrassed, weren’t you?

    How can a conservative win in this atmosphere.

    Nah, Lincoln would have not been a Democrat.

    Jules.

    Like

  9. Fred Mertz says:

    Jules:

    You know I’m (mostly) pulling on your pants leg, right?

    As I said, I was mostly embarrassed by Fort Meyers, except for the end.

    But I do take some issue: the country has not drifted left: it’s always been there, it’s just that the depth and breadth of the neo-con message made it seem like we had moved. But any poll that asks about individual items of a liberal agenda: should we be doing more for education, should health care be more affordable, should the gap been rich and poor be smaller, should we try and stamp out poverty, should we have access to well paying jobs, all come down on the liberal side. The current conservative policies benefit the top 5% income bracket: everyone else loses, that’s the basis of the problem. The right re-phrasing for your Kennedy quote should be “what can we do together for our country”, not “what can I do for myself”?

    It’ll be OK. You lived your formative youth in the golden age of liberalism, and you turned out all right. Maybe there’s a connection there.

    -FM

    Like

  10. Jules Gordon says:

    Fred,
    I checked with the constitution and it did not guarantee anything about wage differential or affordable health care. It also said nothing about guaranteeing “good” or well paying jobs.

    In you socialist world, who decides all of these rthings? Wages, cost of health care,etc.?

    I still prefer freedom, not what you have to offer. As I have said before, your philosophy seems to be winning.

    Now we wait.

    Happy days, Fred.

    Jules.

    Like

  11. Fred Mertz says:

    The most obvious answer, WE do. Each and every time we enter a voting booth. I’m hoping this democracy thing catches on …

    Keep the faith, brother Jules: it would be boring around here if you didn’t!

    -FM

    Like

  12. Jules Gordon says:

    Fred,

    So you vote, as long as they let you, for a demagog president for life ala Hugo Chavez and he/she does what? Determines what’s good for you?

    After a while there will be no WE.

    You keep the faith as well, comrade.

    Jules.

    Like

  13. Jules Gordon says:

    Fred,
    I saw two countries last week who gave up there freedoms, Venezuela and the United States.

    Jules.

    Like

  14. Fred Mertz says:

    Jules:

    What color IS the sky in your world?

    I’m just glad we narrowly averted a neo-(fascist)con takeover this past November!

    -FM

    Like

  15. Jules Gordon says:

    Fred, buddy,

    The color of the sky in my world is RED, WHITE AND BLUE.

    Have a great week end.

    Jules

    Like

  16. Fred Mertz says:

    Jules:

    Well, that explains it. You have it wrapped a little tight. Loosen it up, before you choke!

    -FM

    Like

  17. Jules Gordon says:

    Fred,

    I notice you did try to recover possession of the Red White and Blue as your shared colors.

    Are your colors Red with the sickle and hammer?

    Jules.

    Like

  18. Fred Mertz says:

    Jules:

    No, I just wondered why all the sudden you turned French!

    In fact, I was going to save the argument that I think your own non-socialist, no government spending on people, all free market paradise had been achieved, in post Soviet Russia.

    Can I get you a visa application?

    -FM

    Like

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